Update on Spoilers And Discussion

After some commiserating after my previous post re TFA and spoilers, here’s what I will do:

1. On Friday, I will have an open thread set up by sometime in the afternoon/early evening PST. If you are not seeing the film on Thursday-Friday, avoid this thread until you do. I’ll likely post what I think of the film in the comments.

2. There will be NO prequel bashing, taunting, baiting, or fighting in the comments. Any such comments will be deleted and trolls will be forever banished. If it gets out of hand, I will shut down the open thread and delete the whole thing.

3. Do NOT post spoilers on any other comment thread or post until after December 25. Some of you can’t or won’t see the film for a while and it’s just not realistic in this age of the internet to expect everyone to keep quiet about the movie for several weeks or months.

4. Any posts or discussion tying in themes, events, etc. of TFA with the saga as a whole are fair game after December 25.

5. The rules will be a little looser on the Facebook page. I’ve put a moratorium on spoilers until December 20. I’ll link to the open thread but any and all spoilers are fair game as of Sunday.



99 Responses to “Update on Spoilers And Discussion”

  1. Tarrlok Says:

    A moratorium until the 25th makes for a nice present opening scenario.

  2. Frida Nyberg Says:

    I just watched it, but I’m not sure why I bother reading people’s comments on regular Star Wars-sites, like the official Facebook page. They can’t, THEY JUST CAN’T try to appreciate the new film without hating on the prequels.

    “Finally Star Wars is back”, “thanks JJ, you brought Star Wars back!”, “best Star Wars since 1980”, and so on. -.-
    Why can’t they just appreciate things, without having to hate on others at the same times?

    • lazypadawan Says:

      Oh I quit the official FB page and other outlets like that since they’ve long since been overrun with those kinds of people.

      P.S. they say that now but we’ll see how it is in 6 months or year once the euphora’s worn off and the “overrateds” start appearing.

    • Jim Raynor Says:

      They bring up the Prequels in comparison to The Force Awakens because they’d bring up the Prequels anyway, no matter the topic.

      I see it all the time. In a thread about a specific comic book writer, a detractor might bash him and then say he sucks as much as George Lucas. If people are talking about the great stunts in a new movie, someone will inevitably say that the “practical effects” are better than CGI, as a way to backdoor into another gripe about the Prequels. “The biggest problems with Episodes I-III” are a recurring thread on a lot of scifi genre forums, with people taking it upon themselves to rehash the same one-sided conversation without any outside provocation. Funny given that the “newest” Prequel is already over ten years old.

      The vocal internet crowd just can’t let it go. Not surprising since they’ve been craving the euphoric high they got from seeing the Original Trilogy as kids for decades now.

      • Captain Fordo Says:

        I’m sorry, but I can’t stop laughing at the fact that the retards will think that TFA used much more Practical effects than cgi.
        Yeah cause I’m sure they actually used real x-wings, hired thousands of people to play storm troopers in the Imperial base scene, and barely used any cgi.
        Though unfortunately the haters are plain stupid and suck-ups who only follow “what’s trendy/popular” to say. I bet if Disney didn’t buy this saga from Lucas, we wouldn’t have seen so much haterboys or “hipsters”.

    • Frida Nyberg Says:

      By the way, here’s what I wrote on my blog yesterday, when I just came home: http://argagax.tumblr.com/post/135333982473/so-i-just-saw-the-force-awakens-and-it
      Spoilers are marked, don’t fret.

  3. madmediaman Says:

    Saw the film last night. Quick non-spoiler review (Just my observations):

    Overall I liked it. It was entertaining and held up despite being very mired in OT-centric nostalgia (as expected). A solid entry to the Saga, but not the Second Coming some have elevated it to already.

    My biggest beef is many elements of the story are simply lifted from ANH (subtly re-arranged of course), also some characters really serve no function, or have story threads that are simply dropped (this seems to be a staple of Abrams work).

    Surprisingly one aspect of the film I was most disappointed in was John Williams’ score. Unless he’s referencing earlier themes (e.g., Force Theme, Han & Leia, etc.) his score is largely forgettable and primarily mood music. The action queues could easily have been pulled from Indiana Jones and the Crystal Skull or War of the Worlds.

    My suspicion is Williams’ poor health largely contributed this, and I suspect other composers were brought in to fill in when Williams was unavailable. One segment in particular has strains that sound an awful lot like Abrams’ go-to composer, Michael Giacchino.

    Go in with an open mind; it’s a fun, if sometimes overly familiar ride, but there’s some good stuff here.

    7 out of 10

    • Captain Fordo Says:

      Just watch as the plinket-suck-up trolls will praise this thing as being “better than the Pt”, just watch.

      • andywylde77 Says:

        Oh they plinkett suck ups and others for that fact had been proclaiming that the first teaser for this film was better than the entire PT combined. So yes you are right. They have been doing that since this movie was announced.

    • Stefan Kraft Says:

      I have not watched the movie (as I said, the marketing has led me to postpone the first viewing – may sound pathetic, but that’s my decision).
      Still, some of the characters that “serve no function” or dropped story threads may become important in future installments? We’ll see (and I’m curious whether GL’s ideas were used in EP VII or will be used in EP VIII and IX).

    • hansolo1138 Says:

      Madmediaman, quick question. Would asking about Pegg-hole’s cameo be considered a spoiler? Because I hope it’s not a big one.

    • Anthony Echevarria Says:

      Yeah, at this point in his career, I think Williams is starting to fade. I worry about all of these guys: Williams, Christopher Lee (back when he was alive, and filming the Hobbit movies), Angus Scrimm, etc, from my favorite series, now that they’re all in their twilight years. The good news is that I think Howard Shore and Brian Tyler can potentially fill the void left by Williams in the musical world, if they’re given enough time.

      I haven’t seen the movie yet, but this is just a comment on one of my favorite composers. We’ve already lost Christopher Lee and Leonard Nimoy in the past year, and I can’t help wondering who is going to be the next big personality from the 80’s who passes. I know it’s morbid for a morning topic, but they are definitely thoughts I have. :-/

  4. Captain Fordo Says:

    Oh boy can’t wait to start arguing with the prequel-bashing-plinket-suck-ups./s
    Seriously if I see anyone in real life (or even at the movie theater), start bashing the PT while saying JJs abomination is better, I will not hold back and will beat them up.

    And I’m now inspired to make a video/thread that will nitpick empire strikes back and the rest of the OT. I’m serious on this and have already started drafting it.

    • Jim Raynor Says:

      Cool it with that talk about fighting anyone in real life. We’re still talking about a work of fiction here.

      If Prequel bashers are rude, aggressive, and stupid, Prequel fans owe it to themselves to be the opposite. We need to be better than a stereotype of the bitter fanboy. We need to value intelligence, tolerance, and emotional balance. Things the SW saga teaches and which its most boorish fanboys completely failed to learn.

      The idea of making a basher satire video is something I endorse though. Truthfully, the Original Trilogy has its own set of flaws, including the same ones thst the Prequels get bashed over. I don’t expect a new video to instantly go viral or convince everyone (a lot of these fanboys are beyond convincing) but the pro-Prequel side could use a little more rhetoric on its side. Who knows, maybe the cognitive dissonance of seeing some plot holes and bad “practical effects” or fight choreography in the old movies might actually shut some of them up.

      • Jacobesico Says:

        I see what you’re sayng.

        I have to admit that I sometimes have trouble controlling my anger when it comes to Prequel bashing and I’m forever swearing at the screen when I read some stupid article by some so called critic.

        I’ve resorted to chanting “There is no Emotion. There is Peace” over and over.

      • Captain Fordo Says:

        I’ll admit I was a bit sarcastic about the beating up part as it was mainly due to the nerve some hater boy had in which he threatened me for disagreeing with his bashing.

        Though I do plan on making the vid a bit sarcastic/satirical. Though I admit the RLM will probably ignore it.

    • hansolo1138 Says:

      Not to be negative on your upcoming project, but this has (to a somewhat lesser degree) been done before. Defending the Prequels by nitpicking on the Originals is, IMHO, counterproductive.

      I get that you are likely doing it in greater detail than before, but anyone who sees the video will take it as an attack. And then, to paraphrase Obi-Wan, “You will become what you’ve sought to destroy.” Dissing the OT, even if it is in the interest of the PT, is not the way to defend the Prequels.

    • lazypadawan Says:

      Uh, I don’t think beating people up is a good idea since it’s highly illegal and not to mention not very Jedi-like.

      • maychild Says:

        And more along the lines of what PT-bashers would do. Like when they harass people, including children, for buying PT merchandise, or find such a thing funny.

      • Captain Fordo Says:

        Sorry I forgot to put a /s there. That part was sarcasm.
        Though I did get threats from bashers.

    • Captain Fordo Says:

      I was being sarcastic on the beating up part. If I could edit the post, I would put a “/s” at the end of it or delete it.
      Though I did have a hater boy actually threaten me for disagreeing with their PT-bashing during one of the cons a few years back. Haterboy tried to punch me, but he got punched back and he was later escorted off the premise for his BS.

      • maychild Says:

        I think lp was trying to demonstrate that even saying something sarcastically is not a particularly good idea. I doubt the haters really would have assaulted Lucas or pelted him with rotten eggs if they met him (as they claimed), but that they said it, along with the increasingly violent imagery (Lucas being decapitated with a lightsaber, et al) used by the media, is part of why things got to the ugly state they did.

        And I’m not surprised a hater actually resorted to physical assault when you dared disagree with them. Haters tend to be intolerant, immature punks. They’re like schoolyard bullies who flip out when they finally encounter some resistance. Or like Dudley Dursley screaming that he only got 57 birthday presents instead of 58 (or whatever the amount was).

      • lazypadawan Says:

        Yeah, people can take what you say literally. There’s a guy on Twitter who said to a Well Known Professional Geek he hoped some thing bad happened to him, who then retweeted it to his minions. Just makes us look like psychos. I understand where you’re coming from; I feel the pull of the Dark Side myself ;). Just think of how it will help our side.

  5. Jacobesico Says:

    I’ve got no incentive to see the movie or Episodes 8 and 9.

    I might see it when Episode 9 comes out on DVD but it’s clear that they don’t want the people who grew up with the Prequels seeing it.

    There’s nothing for me now. No Clone Wars. Just Rebels.

    I’ve got episodes 1 to 6 on DVD and I’m content with that.

    I hope the rest of you enjoy it though.

    • Captain Fordo Says:

      Clone wars being canceled is still very painful. It was such a good series and better than the Disney trilogy.

  6. Jim Raynor Says:

    The Rotten Tomatoes score for the new film is extremely high right now at 97%. From reading the critics’ blurbs (no spoilers) the reaction seems to range from “BEST movie ever!!!” to “Best Star Wars since 1980!” down to “fun entertainment but a little too derivative.”

    I’ve always stressed my commitment to maintain an open mind and go into the new movie optimistically. But I wouldn’t be surprised if this is a Star Trek 2009 situation all over again. The critics and fanboys gushed over that movie, being very generous to it simply for being fun and making Star Trek (a franchise that had declined in popularity and become seriously uncool during the 1990s and early 2000s) hip and exciting again. The fact that the movie’s plot illogical and reliant on dumb action didn’t bother many people, mainstream or fanboy.

    It wasn’t until Star Trek into Darkness (a movie that was still successful with critics and general audiences) when fanboy nation turned on JJ Abrams and revised the “consensus” so that he was always a hack who “didn’t get” Star Trek.

    Personally I’m not too fond of the 2009 film, so much that I didn’t watch STiD and have no interest in the upcoming Star Trek Beyond. However, I won’t deny the movie’s actual success the way Prequel haters deny the Prequels’ success.

    It’s just interesting how the internet fanboys can revise history and come up with their own alternate “consensus” and narrative about what everyone supposedly thinks.

    • Captain Fordo Says:

      What, 97%? Bloody haterboys at it again. Funny that it scored higher than the overrated Empire strikes back. Can’t wait to see backlash against it.
      Personally I feel there purposely just inflating the damn movie.

    • hansolo1138 Says:

      “Fun entertainment but a little too derivative?” Hey, the denizens of this site called it months ago! Kudos, SWPAS.

    • lisse Says:

      Thisss. Just give it a few months or till its sequel comes out. Fandom is so predictable. It makes me laugh now to think of the current reputation of the new Star Trek movies among fanboys compared to how it was when they came out. Things are so cyclical tbh that I wouldn’t be surprised with a repeat of that with the new Star Wars sequels.

  7. hansolo1138 Says:

    Welp, it’s receiving acclaim from critics…here’s to the obligatory “TFA redeemed Star Wars” comments from hateboys everywhere.

    Saaay, hold on a sec, didn’t TPM receive initial acclaim from critics? And didn’t said critics drastically change their opinions for the 3D re-release upon finding “everyone” hated it? Hmmm…

    On an unrelated note, did you get that spoiler page idea from me, LP? If so, I’m touched.

    • Captain Fordo Says:

      Hahaha, hater boys are at it as usual. Sadly there a plague that has too big of a voice for its tiny size.
      Though I’m going to laugh if there going to start bashing it.

    • Jim Raynor Says:

      TPM and AOTC received mixed-positive reviews from critics. Both were rated “Fresh” at 62% and 67%.

      TPM’s score was lowered down to 59% (still far from “raped my childhood” territory) after the 2012 3D re-release, when a couple dozen bloggers decided to take the opportunity to bash the movie for shallow reasons like the use of CGI.

      AOTC was at 67% (a 2 to 1 postive ratio), with RT’s “consensus” being that it was somewhat a return to foem for the SW franchise.

      ROTS was at a stronf 80%, and was hailed as one of the best SW movies of either trilogy. It too was the franchise’s “return to form.”

      A decade later, the fanboy revisionist media pushes the narrative that ALL of the Prequels sucked, and that The Force Awakens is the TRUE franchise savior.

      It’s downright bizarre how authoritative yet out of step the fanboy narrative is. How it shifts and comes full circle to everything still sucking. Even the critics don’t hate as much as they do.

      • Captain Fordo Says:

        Sad but true. I remember back in 2005 to ~ 2012 (when Disney bought Star Wars), Revenge of the sigh was always considered the 1st or 2nd best movie on most people’s favorites lists.
        Now though, everything’s been tainted by the filth known as RedLetterMedia.

  8. susanbowes Says:

    Good idea! Facebook wasn’t too bad today, although they did have a video of the London Premiere which I did watch. They played the beginning of TFA, but thankfully didn’t show the screen. I did hear the beginning of the film however, and just from that alone I know the movie is going to be fantastic! Can’t wait to see it! 🙂

  9. susanbowes Says:

    I agree with Jim Raynor and say it’s time for us to prove we’re better than the haters. Even though I’m making the Lucas Appreciation video with the haters in mind – telling Mr. Lucas that we love ALL his films, (disregarding haters nasty remarks about the prequels) I think I do it with taste by not outright condemning the haters. Let them destroy themselves. That will happen for certain.

    • maychild Says:

      Oh, I don’t plan on sinking to the level of the hateboys. I doubt I’ll hate TFA, and even if I do, I’m not a hateful, bile-filled loser who spends half a lifetime spewing increasingly extreme hatred at a MOVIE.

      But I’ll remind them of their hypocrisy when they screech about “excessive negativity from prequel fans” (which is HARDLY the case) and urge the people who don’t think TFA is a masterpiece to “move on.” After all, they’ve been wailing for 16 years about the prequels, and when asked to move on, they said, “Don’t tell me what to do. It would be boring if everyone agreed.”

      Now suddenly the rules have changed.

      Oh, and the haters claimed that any positive reviews of the prequels were the result of “Lucas’s bribes.” Of course, they claim the positive reviews of TFA are all entirely sincere and no way, no how did the (minor, mom-and-pop studio) Disney have any influence on the critics, monetary or otherwise. To say so is to be a “conspiracy theorist.”

  10. maychild Says:

    Interesting how TFA is getting praise for its “dazzling effects…a mixture of practical and CGI.”

    The PT had that same mix and was called every vile name imaginable.

    • lazypadawan Says:

      Lucasfilm should issue a press release on December 21 that Lucas really made TFA and this was all an elaborate prank. Watch. Heads. Explode.

      • maychild Says:

        Well, without a doubt, the same people who are all but having orgasms over TFA would back off in a hurry, and put out reassessments that point out the film’s flaws, and claim that they were doing so because they “reconsidered over time and with a second viewing.”

        After all, the prequel-haters watched each prequel in the theater at least three times, some as many as eight, and when asked why they kept viewing a movie they hated beyond all reason, it was either, “I didn’t know how much I hated it until later” or “I was just trying to see if it was really as bad as I thought the first (and second, and third, and fourth, and…) time.”

      • Adam Says:


      • hansolo1138 Says:

        That would not only be brilliant, but an awesome and a perfect way to show the hypocrisy of Lucas’ haters. It’s almost certainly untrue, but I am somewhat slightly more realistically hoping that TFA was actually made from Lucas’ story outline, and Disney only changed certain details like the protagonists not being teenagers, etc.

        There is little to no chance of that happening…but a guy can dream, can’t he?

    • Captain Fordo Says:

      Hypocrisy at its finest.

    • Stefan Kraft Says:

      Well, you could argue that EP II and III relied more on CGI than EP I (maybe because GL wanted to push the boundaries) etc. (even if they still used a lot of practical effects!)
      The “advantage” of EP VII is that a) JJ may have had a more conservative approach than GL, and that b) CGI has evolved since 2005 – no wonder it looks better.
      Anyway, it is not a black-and-white discussion, but more often than not, Darth Media will use simple statements like the one maychild has mentioned.

  11. Shamari Stewart Says:

    I’m seeing the movie at 1:30 EST so I’ll be able to comment on it in the thread afterwards, which is nice. I highly doubt the movie will be better than ROTS (which I hold in very high esteem, still might be my favorite movie period) but I’m hopeful that it will at least be decent and not be a rehash of the original movies.

    A lot of people like it, but I also don’t know if those people would’ve been happy with anything that isn’t like the prequels and that reminded them of the “good old days.” I’m sure it’ll be a fun movie, but star wars is more than just “fun” so my expectations are higher than that (it doesn’t have to be a religious experience, but be a good star wars movie! One deserving of being in the franchise).

    But I agree with everyone saying they wish the praising of this movie didn’t have to come attached to “So much better than those lousy prequels!” As if the prequels aren’t literally way better than 90% of the shit movies that come out nowadays on a daily basis.

  12. ladylavinia1932 Says:

    Dissing the OT, even if it is in the interest of the PT, is not the way to defend the Prequels.

    So . . . any form of criticism against the OT or ST movies is considered “bashing” or “dissing”? Because I have already criticized both the OT and PT movies in my reviews.

    • hansolo1138 Says:

      What I mean by that is we should not try to elevate half (or 1/3) of the saga in favor of the other. We shouldn’t say, “If the PT was bad, then so was the OT” or “Hamill was just as bad as Christensen” or “The OT’s original effects have aged terribly.” That’s the kind of bashing we need to avoid.
      Constructive criticisms of both trilogies, the way you have described, is one thing. What I described above is another.

  13. Eduardo Vargas Says:

    So as it turns out, I’ll be seeing the film 2 or 3 times, depending on how many family members wish to see it with me. Although I do have to say, I’m not really looking forward to it.

    If there is one thing that I am grateful for, Is that I have noticed that many of the people who disliked the PT and haven’t liked this film, have gone on record to give credit to the fact that George at least took risks and made original stories.

    At least their seems to be a light at the end of the tunnel for the PT

    • Stefan Kraft Says:

      (I am again in off-topic territory here, but as long as LP does not say anything…) I am curious how the narrative will look like in the end.
      In the best case, the positive reception of the PT we have seen recently will grow, and while it may not be “the PT is as good as the OT,” it will be considered as “not bad/interesting/…” In the worst case, I fear that it will be “after the disappointing/awful PT, Disney refreshed and saved SW as it was necessary.” Not sure how it will turn out, but I am rather pessimistic.

  14. Natalie Says:

    I hate to be a Negative Nelly (especially since that’s what the bashers did before the prequels release) but, to quote our favorite saga, I have a bad feeling about this.

    I disliked JJ’s Star Trek (aka ANH rehash 1.0) despite the critical acclaim and popularity so the chances are, so chances are high, I’m going to feel the same for ANH rehash 2.0. I already know the music is lacking and so is the action. I read the spoilers and I don’t like the story developments. I couldn’t care less about the “used universe” everyone is gushing about, I’d rather see something new and interesting (and it’s not as if the PT was 100% new and shiny, it was actually pretty used too, just in a better shape than a war torn Galaxy in ANH). The mythology of the Force doesn’t seem to advance either. I’m sure the performances from Ford and the young cast are going to be solid with decent dialogue (that’s something that Lucas himself admits is not his strong suit) but honestly I don’t watch Star Wars for acting or dialogue so that’s not enough to keep me entertained if the plot is a rehash/remake/reboot and there’s not interesting bigger picture.

    Once upon a time, Star Wars was about awing us with never before seen mixture of futuristic, ancient, epic, mundane, whimsical, mythic – now it’s all about returning to the familiar. Why? What happened? When was imagination and creative replaced by same old, same old?

    • lazypadawan Says:

      The internet and the rise of geek culture. If you want to know why there are so many reboots and remakes it’s because movies have to come pre-sold since they are so expensive. People who want originality are watching cable and streaming programs. I’m actually more excited for what’s coming on television in 2016 than I am for any movie. Even revivals like “The X-Files” and “Twin Peaks” are still in the hands of their respective creators, so I’m interested in them and I hope to see things move forward on those shows.

      We’ll see how I think tomorrow!

    • susanbowes Says:

      Imagination and creativity was deleted the second Disney brought the franchise.

  15. Pedro Felipe Says:

    This will be the Star Wars movie with the worst soundtrack ever. And I still have to hear prequel haters defending the indefensible saying it’s better than the prequel soundtrack, saying that they just reused duel of the fates (believe it or not). My intellect was hurt by that one. Let us not forget that directors play a big part in how the soundtrack turns out. Also, after all that prequel bashing marketing campaign, the best parts of the soundtrack are prequel references and prequel style compositions. Funny how prequel haters point heavily prequel-influenced parts of the soundtrack as the best ones without admiting it.

    • Natalie Says:

      That must be some hardcore haters. The score (and the sounds) are the only things usually left alone because even the haters don’t want to look totally stupid.

    • susanbowes Says:

      I’ve listened to the soundtrack from vids posted on youtube and I think it’s pretty good. Maybe not as good as the prequel’s scores, especially the love theme from AOTC, but I still liked the music.

    • roxam91 Says:

      Wait… I haven’t heard anything from the soundtrack yet, but did it actually include prequel themes?

  16. twessf Says:

    I’m cautiously excited to see it tonight. I’ve sought out the more level headed , clear eyed reviews…most say the movie is wildly & universally entertaining, and the characters are great – however it would be best seen with the expectation of viewing it as a soft re-boot and love letter to the original trilogy. They say it is a fun, thrill ride…nothing more, nothing less. I’m a OT leaning Complete Saga Fan (and just a general fan of George Lucas, the man, storyteller, business maverick). Here’s always been my assessment:

    OT – Genius level concept, Great execution
    PT – Genius Level concept but incredibly riskier (which is the only way it could be exciting), Uneven Execution (but the heart was in the right place)

    Here’s is my expectation for the Force Awakens – An excellent execution (albeit white passion and heart) of a Corporate Initiative. Kind of like a great (2 hour long) Super Bowl ad for the new era of the franchise. 😉

    • Natalie Says:

      Bah an average MCU movie is a thrill ride. Jurassic World was a thrill ride. I want something more. Like, you know, watching it again for the 50th time and finding a new detail I missed before.

      By the way, that’s what they said about the prequels but apparently it wasn’t enough then.

    • lazypadawan Says:

      Here’s the thing…I want the saga to move forward instead of being a soft reboot or a love letter to movies somebody else already made.

      • lisse Says:

        Same. The idea that these characters haven’t grown, that this world hasn’t grown, makes everything seem…pointless. I don’t want a reset. I want evolution. Maybe it’ll come in the latter movies, but starting off with a reset to the ANH makes me wonder why I wouldn’t just watch ANH and its sequels instead of a lesser copy of that narrative.

  17. andywylde77 Says:

    I wonder what the next established franchise that JJ will get his hands on?

    Well I guess SW got back to its roots and is now back in a “used” universe? While I type that I am shrugging my shoulders and shaking my head back and forth too. This is one of the most stupidest things that gets brought up within the SW fandom. I mean was Tattooine less used or lived in during the PT than it was in the OT? It seemed all the same to me. I mean heck, they even had poopy on the ground in Mos Espa in episode 1! Now if that doesn’t say “lived in” or “used” than I don’t know what does?

    • susanbowes Says:

      Everyone is blaming JJ for everything that happened as far as TFA goes, but he may not be guilty of dismissing Lucas’ ideas at all. He only directed the movie and had no control over what Disney did. If blame is to be had, that credit goes to Kennedy because she’s in charge of Lucasfilms now and she didn’t have to go along with the execs at Disney. She could’ve fought for her old boss, but she stabbed Lucas in the back and is no better than Darth Sidious in my opinion.

  18. andywylde77 Says:

    I was also curious for those who seen the film, was there a credit to George Lucas on the screen? If so was it by itself or was it mixed with a bunch of other names?

    At most I would expect that there would be a shot in the credits in big letters that say story and characters based on SW by George Lucas. If that isn’t there than that really is pretty bad and disrespectful.

  19. Daniel Xie Says:

    These are not my opinions but here is some food for thought:


    • lazypadawan Says:

      There are some inaccuracies in there; Episode VIII’s script was written by Rian Johnson and not Michael Arndt. I don’t think boycotts as a whole work but it’s up to the individual to decide what he or she wants to do.

  20. Natalie Says:

    More from the prequel defender

  21. ladylavinia1932 Says:

    This movie has very little originality. Very very little. But it’s J.J. His best movie, “SUPER 8” was basically a rehash of a “STAR TREK VOYAGER” episode called “Prey”. Abrams. Oh well. I only hope that Rian Johnson will do better with Episode VIII.

  22. Steven F Says:

    I just came from seeing the film. I mostly hated it. I’m a rabid Star Wars fan and love the prequels. I think it’s biggest crime is that its actually poorly directed. It’s originality I kinda knew going in as I had kept up with spoilers but it felt more like a tv show then a real cinematic experience. It doesn’t have the visual flair and sense of filmmaking that ep. 1-6 had. I know there’s a ton of positive reviews out there but it’s hype. Positive things I did like was I guess the opening crawl was good and I liked the sound. The music was decent. I don’t want to say too much about the characters as you should experience it yourself and I can’t wait to read all of your opinions in the next few days. I think, in time, when all the hype has finished, people will come back to the Prequels and see just how well made those films really are. I can have hope 🙂

  23. audioepics Says:

    I enjoyed it on the level of pure entertainment. It does that very, very well. But it’s not just derivative. It really is just a remake of ANH. It is so shockingly unoriginal that my jaw dropped. So much more could be done with the Star Wars universe. Sooo much more. It has no vision whatsoever. It’s sad that all of the EU had to go out of the window for this. But I still had a great time. The characters are likeable and the movie has a good sense of fun. But it’s just another movie. And with Lucas, we got a real vision.

  24. audioepics Says:

    And you know what’s weird? After having seen TFA, I really feel like it’s cemented in my consciousness that I prefer the PT over all the rest. The universe we see in the PT is just so much more rich and alive and engaging to me than what we get in all the other Star Wars movies. The broad vision of a galactic society on display in the prequel universe is just completely gone in all the other episodes and I miss that much more than I miss anything from the OT in the prequels.

  25. Stefan Kraft Says:

    I am just wondering: many are praising TFA for its inclusive cast. *And DON’T get me wrongo, the cast diversity is a really good thing*!
    However, could it be that the “average SWPAS member” does not take this as the absolute best thing that has happened to SW because of the other strong females characters we have encountered? Remember the interesting analyses about Padmé that were linked to on this blog? And then there is obviously Ahsoka, well-known to SWPAS members?

    And I have the impression that SWPAS visitors tend to see TFA more as a rehash of ANH than other fans. (I may not do justice to TFA by calling it a “rehash”, but I hope you get my point.) Is this due to the appreciation of the PT, which was still SW, but with a different twist? On the other hand, I have read other Saga fans that say that TFA feels different to the OT and the PT. Hmmm…

    What do you think about my observations?

  26. audioepics Says:

    So you mean to say that we embrace… a larger view of the saga, instead of the narrow, dogmatic view of the fanboys? 🙂

    Joking aside, I cannot see for the life of me how so many people can be so blind to the copy-paste job that JJ has done with the plot. I guess they have a kind of “hype goggles” on. They are so excited, they so WANT it to be awesome, that they’ll forgive a lot more than they would another movie. Also because they want to prove that the prequels were bad by pointing to a “real” Star Wars movie (according to them).

    I do agree that this movie feels different from all the others, purely in terms of its atmosphere. And I like that. I also really like the character-driven humor. Those are JJ’s strengths.

  27. Natalie Says:

    Again, an average Marvel movie has funny moments. None of them have Star Wars gravitas. I personally don’t think SW must have comedy or it’s not SW. Even ROTS has a few light-hearted moments. That’s enough for me.

  28. Steven F Says:

    I think my initial reaction of just hating it was a bit strong. There were definitely parts I did enjoy and some of it was fun. It is Star Wars after all! But after enjoying the prequels its pretty jarring to then watch TFA which just does not have the depth or the storytelling of the earlier films. Even with the OT, going from ROTJ with its stunning visuals and pacing to TFA takes abit of adjustment. Its fun but its not on the level of the other films.

    • susanbowes Says:

      Without using Lucas’ ideas, I didn’t expect TFA would be as good as the rest of the movies, both the OT and the Prequels and from what people are saying about TFA, I was right.

      • Natalie Says:

        Unfortunately. It’s like taking Tolkien out of Middle-earth or J.K.Rowling out of Harry Potter. These worlds are too tied to their creators. Yes, there were successful projects produced by other people but the best of them utilized GL’s ideas to some extent (TCW especially).

  29. Natalie Says:

    Even some folks who were critical of the prequels (not haters, just disappointed) are saying it’s the worst one yet. Yes, the acting and dialogue is better, but something is missing, like a sense of wonder (and the music doesn’t add much). KK believed the bashers and made a critical mistake by dismissing Lucas’s ideas. Rian Johnson better get some of the back in or it’s all over for Star Wars.

  30. andywylde77 Says:

    The problem with this new movie is, at least to me seems to be that Disney and co. were in a rush to get this out. JJ now has his mic drop moment for the time being while accomplishing nothing and leaving the real work for the next directors to deal with.

    I am actually looking more forward to seeing Batman vs. Superman. Never thought that would happen when a new SW movie being out, but here I am.

    • Natalie Says:

      Arndt wanted a year more than they were willing to give. Even if his draft wasn’t based on Lucas’s anymore I think it would’ve been less rehashed anyway. I have some hopes for Rian, but he didn’t have much time either. Disney forgot this is not Marvel with its wealth of pre-existing stories (which they don’t utilize all that well apparently). It’s an original saga with a very dense storytelling mode (dialogue+vision+soundtrack), you can’t rush these things.

      Just removing “boring” politics and adding humor is not enough (especially since politics have always been a part of SW, see ANH). It might be just a blockbuster for some people, but for a lot of us, it’s about rewatchibility. That’s why the OT have held up so well despite outdated sfx, and the hated (supposedly) prequels are still selling well both as part of the saga and as a separate trilogy.

      • andywylde77 Says:

        Yeah that is what I pretty much figured. Because all the stuff I heard about starting from scratch and having the movie out quickly after. Yes politics have always been a part of SW. I mean if we look at the title of the whole thing it is Star Wars. Most wars do start in the political arena. So it is just logical. I loved the whole political angle that was in the PT. It added so much more and really gave the SW universe so much depth. I mean the OT was 3 movies of good vs. evil. Which is still great, but I don’t think another 3 movies after that of good vs evil would have worked. I am thankful that the PT went the route it did. But from all the spoilers I have been hearing and reading it seems that this go around of the SW universe may have forgotten about that which you stated about SW being an original saga. Then this leaves me to believe they are going the MCU route with SW now too. And that will surely sink the SW franchise. Because SW is unique and won’t really work with the MCU style. MCU works for MCU though.

  31. ladylavinia1932 Says:

    The politics is there in TFA. Isn’t there some conflict regarding “the Resistance” and “the First Order”?

    • andywylde77 Says:

      Yes I believe that is also correct. From what I have heard though it seems that the political aspect of the new film may not be that well displayed on screen. And that will be a shame if it is,

      • Natalie Says:

        They don’t reestablish the universe at all. JJ Abrams said the politics are for the middle-aged people. I guess all the kids hate the politics in Harry Pooter, Narnia, Lord of the Rings books. They can’t wait to grow up so that they don’t have to deal with them and be served dumbed down popcorn movies.

      • andywylde77 Says:

        I didn’t know JJ said that? But I would expect that from him. I am almost forty so I guess I won’t like this movie because politics are for middle agers! lol But I remember as a kid in elementary school doing “current events” where we would have to find a news article and report on it. And are these people really afraid to have any political stuff in these new films as it would make the morons think,

        I believe that in real life politics on some level would be a good thing for kids to know or be aware of at least? Because politics is something that all people deal with at some point or take notice of at the very least.

    • Jim Raynor Says:

      The “politics” of the film are so vague that you hardly even know what the factions are supposed to be.

      TPM gets torn to shreds by some people online because the nitty gritty of the trade taxes wasn’t completely spelled out for them. The mere mention of taxes was too much to bear, but the movie also lost points for NOT dwelling on that stuff. With the hypocritical and illogical standards imposed upon it, the movie can’t win at all.

      Meanwhile, TFA gets praised for not bothering to explain at all.

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